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Thomas Læssøehttps://svampe.databasen.org/observations/10527903
Sur vératre
Andgelo Mombert,
16-08-2017 19:47
Bonsoir à tous,De belles fructifications (4 mm de diamètre) sur tiges mortes de Veratrum album, vers 1700 m d'altitude. Orsières, Valais, Suisse.
Spores 13 x 5 µm, elliptiques, lisses, hyalines, septés à maturité, avec 3 noyaux (ou plus ?).
Asques 90 x 7 µm, octosporés bisériés, crochets présents, sommet amyloïde (deux traits bleu parallèles).
Paraphyses 3µm de large, cylindriques, farcies de guttules réfringentes.
Excipulum ectal composé d'hyphes tortueuses et remplies de guttules réfringentes, noyées dans du gel.
Je ne vois pas du tout de quoi il peut s'agir.
Merci d'avance pour votre expertise !
Andgelo
Michel Hairaud,
16-08-2017 20:09
Re : Sur vératre
Bonsoir Andgelo,
As tu pensé au genre Ombrophila ? Il me semble distinguer une teinte violette
Amitiés
Michel
As tu pensé au genre Ombrophila ? Il me semble distinguer une teinte violette
Amitiés
Michel
Gilbert MOYNE,
16-08-2017 21:32
Re : Sur vératre
Salut Andgelo,
Les spore me font penser à Pezoloma hericola mais ....
Gilbert
Les spore me font penser à Pezoloma hericola mais ....
Gilbert
Michel Hairaud,
16-08-2017 21:45
Re : Sur vératre
Bonsoir Gilbert,
L'espèce à laquelle tu penses et que nousavons récolté à Somiedo sur ce support a des spores plus obtuses aux extémités et ne laissent apparaitre qu'un seul noyau, il me semble.
Amitiés
Michel
L'espèce à laquelle tu penses et que nousavons récolté à Somiedo sur ce support a des spores plus obtuses aux extémités et ne laissent apparaitre qu'un seul noyau, il me semble.
Amitiés
Michel
Hans-Otto Baral,
16-08-2017 22:00
Re : Sur vératre
HI Andgelo and others
I would be happy to see the spores in higher resolution, e.g. regarding the nuclei. Also I would apopreciate more than only one value for length and width.
Important would be to see a photo of the amyloid ascus apex. The paraphysis content remind me strongly for something like Phaeohelotium imberbe, but the large spores exclude that. Also the apo stipe looks like highly gelatinised. I wonder about the medulla, is it gelatinised too? Are there any crystals outside or in the flesh?
Possibly a section would be difficult, especially if it is an Ombrophila what I also suppose. The apical ring structure would be important to see in order to use my Ombrophila key.
Zotto
p.s. just looked at my files, and I find one very similar: Ombrophila "cicerbitae" HB 3272. It has a strongly gelatinised medulla with crystals, spores and VBs in the paraphyses just as yours, and an apical ring of the Calycina-type (V-like).
I would be happy to see the spores in higher resolution, e.g. regarding the nuclei. Also I would apopreciate more than only one value for length and width.
Important would be to see a photo of the amyloid ascus apex. The paraphysis content remind me strongly for something like Phaeohelotium imberbe, but the large spores exclude that. Also the apo stipe looks like highly gelatinised. I wonder about the medulla, is it gelatinised too? Are there any crystals outside or in the flesh?
Possibly a section would be difficult, especially if it is an Ombrophila what I also suppose. The apical ring structure would be important to see in order to use my Ombrophila key.
Zotto
p.s. just looked at my files, and I find one very similar: Ombrophila "cicerbitae" HB 3272. It has a strongly gelatinised medulla with crystals, spores and VBs in the paraphyses just as yours, and an apical ring of the Calycina-type (V-like).
Ombrophila-cicerbitae-HB-3272-0001.JPG
Andgelo Mombert,
17-08-2017 17:04
Re : Sur vératre
Merci Zotto,
Ça pourrait coller avec ta récolte !
Spores 13-15 x 4,5-5,5 µm. J'ai observé des spores qui murissent (voir photo 1 en haut à gauche).
Difficile de faire une photo de la récation des asques...
J'ai fait un prélèvement dans la chair, voir photo 3 et 4. C'est gélatinisé.
Il me semble apercevoir des cristaux dans la chair (photo 5).
Andgelo
Ça pourrait coller avec ta récolte !
Spores 13-15 x 4,5-5,5 µm. J'ai observé des spores qui murissent (voir photo 1 en haut à gauche).
Difficile de faire une photo de la récation des asques...
J'ai fait un prélèvement dans la chair, voir photo 3 et 4. C'est gélatinisé.
Il me semble apercevoir des cristaux dans la chair (photo 5).
Andgelo
Hans-Otto Baral,
17-08-2017 21:36
Re : Sur vératre
Yes, they are crystals. The "nuclei" in the spores are vacuoles, surely the spores are only 1-nucleate. The only deviation I see is the apical ring which is actually of Hymenoscyphus-type.
Now I see with my key I would definitely arrive at cypericola for your fungus because of the apical ring. You may also have seen that I put both species in one folder. In any case, the apical ring is so different on my drawings between my two samples that I cannot imagine they were the same.
Zotto
Now I see with my key I would definitely arrive at cypericola for your fungus because of the apical ring. You may also have seen that I put both species in one folder. In any case, the apical ring is so different on my drawings between my two samples that I cannot imagine they were the same.
Zotto
Andgelo Mombert,
17-08-2017 21:58
Re : Sur vératre
D'accord !
Donc hormis l'anneau apical, cypericola et cicerbitae possèdent les mêmes caractères microscopiques ?
Andgelo
Donc hormis l'anneau apical, cypericola et cicerbitae possèdent les mêmes caractères microscopiques ?
Andgelo
Hans-Otto Baral,
17-08-2017 22:27
Re : Sur vératre
yes, seems so! Not sure if the margin is similarly crenulate in cypericola.
Andgelo Mombert,
18-08-2017 09:54
Re : Sur vératre
OK merci Zotto.
Andgelo
Andgelo