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Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
Javier Ormad, 10-12-2011 12:45
Javier Ormad¡Hola, de nuevo!

Apotecios amarillos citrinos, en parte externa de cúpula de fruto (bellota) de Quercus coccifera. Hasta 1 mm de diámetro.Ascas sin croziers, dudosa reacción amiloide; esporas con septo central y vacuolas; parafisis con pigmento citrino, uniformes; excípulo ectal con textura intrincata.                                                      
Serán recibidas con agrado, todas las sugerencias.
Gracias


Lemon yellow apothecia, partly external dome of fruit (acorn) of Quercus coccifera. Up to 1 mm in diameter. ASCI without croziers, dubious reaction amyloid; spores with central septum and vacuoles; parafisis with citrine pigment, uniform; excípulum ectal textured intrincata.
They will be received with pleasure, all the suggestions.         
Thank you

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Hans-Otto Baral, 10-12-2011 13:44
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
Good documentatuion, and very interesting! Seems to be a Calycina (incl. Bisporella p.pt.). Did you measure the spores? How sure are you with absence of croziers?

Bisporella clarflava = B. sulfurina shows similarities, but is inamyloid.

Zotto
Javier Ormad, 10-12-2011 14:24
Javier Ormad
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
It has to be Bisporella claroflava, common in the area. Never I saw on domes of fruit of Q. coccifera. Almost all the inamyloid photos, but this picture gives me doubts. Croziers, also more doubts.
Measures spores 9-11 x 2.5-3 microns

Javier
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Hans-Otto Baral, 10-12-2011 17:23
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
Quite clearly without croziers (which is typical of claroflava).

Your right ascus is inamyloid, but your left? Have you more IKI-images of asci?

Spore size fits well clatroflava.

Zotto
Javier Ormad, 10-12-2011 20:37
Javier Ormad
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
I am thinking, inamyloid, but the image made me doubt.
Bisporella claroflava is very cosmopolitan, but had not yet seen in fruit of Quercus coccifera.

Javier
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Raúl Tena Lahoz, 10-12-2011 22:05
Raúl Tena Lahoz
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
Hi Zotto & Javier

I think that it is a shadow below the ascus that gives the impression to be euamyloid.
Anyway, I have seen more or less grayish in IKI for claroflava.

Raúl
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Hans-Otto Baral, 10-12-2011 22:11
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
Hi Raul & Javier

that's really good. Sometimes an amyloid ring is visible already without iodine. But that an inamyloid ring is visible is new to me! Or do you think that the greyish ring is invisible without IKI?

Zotto
René Dougoud, 11-12-2011 09:36
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
Chers Collèges,

Je pense qu'il s'agit de Bisporella sulfurina.

Voici mes dessins réalisés à partir d'une récolte faite dernièrement

Le contenu de la paraphyse de droite, est décoloré par le KOH

Amitiés

René
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Raúl Tena Lahoz, 11-12-2011 13:26
Raúl Tena Lahoz
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
Hi Zotto & René

I do not know what to think... I attach a pic of the ascus fully turgescent where you can see two apical dots (more or less ;-)), but not the hole apical canal. I send you a Picasa link to your mail with the others pics.

Could you explain us why you think it is better to call it claroflava instead of sulfurina?

Merci René pour ton dessin.

Raúl
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René Dougoud, 11-12-2011 14:11
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
Cher Raoul,

Bisporella claroflava (Grev.) Lizo? & Korf, Mycotaxon 54: 474 (1995)? et placé en synonymie avec Bisporella citrina (Batsch) Korf & S.E. Carp., Mycotaxon 1(1): 58 (1974)?.
Voir : http://www.speciesfungorum.org/Names/SynSpecies.asp?RecordID=309569?

L'espèce est donc, sur cette base, distincte de B. sulfurina.

J'espère que tu vas bien ? Je te transmets mes cordiaux et amicaux messages et je garde un très bon souvenir de notre rencontre.

René
Hans-Otto Baral, 11-12-2011 14:50
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
Dear all

Bisporella claroflava was thought to be a synonym of B. sulphurina by Lizon & Korf 1995, see attach.

As synonyms they list also B. discedens, and Helotium citrinicolor.

About sulphurina they write:

Korf & Zhuang (1985) expressed doubt if B. discedens can be really
distinguished from the common Bisporella sulphurina (Quél.) S. E.
Carpenter. This species seems to be really closely related to B. claro_ava
and it may be conspecific. Quélet's collections were partly destroyed
(Gilbert, 1949) and also the type specimen of Helotium sulphurinum
Quél. is missing at PC (R. Cailleux, in litt.). Until a lectotype or neotype
is chosen for Quélet's species, no conclusions can be made.?

Raul: your pic of living ascus is also in IKI? Again one could easily think this is amyloid, but it isn't. More clear results with rings  are obained in dead asci, anyhow your last example shows that this is not very clear in this species.

Zotto
Raúl Tena Lahoz, 11-12-2011 15:51
Raúl Tena Lahoz
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
Merci pour tes mots amicaux René. Je aussi garde un souvenir très agréable. Et merci pour les explications.


And thanks Zotto for your explanation too. My last photo is in water. Next time I do micro of this species I will focus more on apical pore. I attach the macro with its common partner on Eucalyptus: Calycina "heterospora"

Raúl 

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Hans-Otto Baral, 11-12-2011 16:33
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
Great!!
Zotto
Javier Ormad, 13-12-2011 21:34
Javier Ormad
Re : Discomycete cúpula Quercus coccifera
Algo habitual por lo que parece,  hasta en Quercus suber
Saludos
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