It's got quite big spores, 12-18 x1,5-2 containing some small droplets:

Asci are 40-60x4-6, IKI- and paraphyses about 1-2 micrometers wide, not particulary swollen at the tips.

Is this O. vinosa?

Curiously: Marja

Hi Marja,
I think you are right
cheers Stip

yes, and Stip is also all right :-)

I am sure Guy Marson would now search for conidia around the apothecia, because there are perhaps three different subspecies with very different branched conidia (Trinacrium, Dwayaangam).

Could you please tell me more data? How far was the substrate above the snow? I would like to note the data (date and site). I am not sure if I have a Finish collection of O. vinosa at all.

Only 0-5 cm snow here...
Zotto

Hi Zotto,

I collected these last sunday (30.1.2011) from my neighbourhood Raivionmäki (part of town), Outokumpu (town), North Carelia.
One of my neighbours had cut a Prunus padus, that was bending over the road.
There were some twigs fallen on the road and I picked some.
So I have no idea of how much above the snow it was ealier.
And it was above because it looked dry, not even icy, so some other branches had shadowed it.

There must be a collection of O. vinosa from Karsten somewhere, but propably no others from Finland...

I'll try to look for more microdata later, if my Old Russian shows something more ;)

I've found Orbilias ealier during winter, too. They stand very well the cold circumstances, just schrink almoust to nonexistence.
I've sometimes found them only after bringing a twig inside because of something else on them too.

Marja

Hi Marja

that's fine, you know where to find them. O.vinosa is among the most commonest of drought-tolerant Orbilias.

You said the spores contain some small droplets. Did you notice the very elongate spore body? Visible in your left and central spore.

Oh yes, Karsten collected O. vinosa and the parasite Helicogonium orbiliarum near Merimasku, and described this as O. rubinella by overlooking the parasite-host relation.

Zotto

Lets see,

I got the instruction of conidia hunting from Guy.
Unfortunately I can not obey them because of lack of instruments.
So I introduce my own method :)
I used a pipette from an old medicine bottle and infected it ;)

I found something or let's say many.
They are about 30-50 micrometers long and have 2-4 branches.
Is this what was wanted?

About that spore body. I don't know, what it is. But suppose you mean the wider end with a longer droplet, which could be easier seen with a smaller magnification of the Old Russian

Marja

Dear Marja

Wonderful! Did you make photos of more conidia? Are they all such 4-armed?

This type of Trinacrium with 4 arms is so far not clear to which Orbilia it belongs. From which collection did you get them, from that of O. vinosa?

Zotto

Dear Otto,

you right. It is from the same collection as this threat.
I found 2,3 and 4 armed ones and took photos which I dont't start to put in one so here's some.
With 2 branches, which you call arms:

3 armed:

And another with 4 arms:

Hope this helps: Marja

My only idea is the following: we had one collection in the Swiss mountains (at 880 m), where O. vinosa carried these conidia. But They we assume that they do not belong to this Orbilia but to an undescribed Hyalorbilia which grew there in close vicinity. In the attach you see thiy Hyalorbilia, very small, cream-coloured.

Perhaps you find anything similar around the apos?

Zotto

Hi Otto,

I put the specimen drying, but can give it some moisture.
I'll look, but have some doubts.
Did you notice the growing pattern on those conidias? Could they be really growing and belong to the same species? Maybe its only my imagination ;) With no knowledge one can at least make wrong assumptions...

Marja

The conidia you found surely belong to one species. That's variation which we often have in Orbilia and which makes life heavy but interesting. Some species produce macro- and quite different microconidia. But variation between two and four arms, or branched and unbranched conidia, is quite normal, and some articles were written mainly about that phenomenon. This illustrates how artificial these various genera with staurospores are, such as Dwayaangam, Curucispora etc. F.ex.. in O. aristata you have Trinacrium (two arms and one stipe = 3 extremities), Curucispora (like a cross) and Dwayaangam (5 extremities) as anamorph in one species.

Zotto

Hi,

I moistured the specimen an studied it with a 30x magnification loupe.
I saw no other fruitbodies.
The Hyalorbilia seems to be about 0,1-0,2 mm wide and so quite easy to distinguish (almoust even without a loupe).
Is there some documents about Orcilia conidia in your DVD?
It's my shame, that I've studied just a little part of that material.

Marja

There is a folder in Orbiliomycetes called "1a Anamorphs, survey". I hope it existed already in 2005. There are lots of drawings. But for text on ana-.teleo relations you must wait our monograph, :-)

Zotto